Episode 274: The Church Isn’t Perfect, But Jesus Still Is
With Jeff and Terra Mattson and special guest Natalie Runion
In this heartfelt episode, we sit down with Natalie Runion, author, pastor, and founder of Raised to Stay, to talk about the real and often painful journey of healing from church hurt while staying rooted in Jesus. Together, we unpack what it means to deconstruct without destroying, to discern when it’s time to leave a toxic system, and to rebuild faith and community with integrity. We explore how leaders can slow down, lead with humility, and create safe spaces where grace and truth can coexist. Whether you’re a pastor, a church member, or someone who’s walked away for a season, this conversation offers hope, honesty, and a way forward.
Key Takeaways
Abiding over performing: Staying isn’t about remaining in a specific church—it’s about remaining in Christ, even through disillusionment.
Healthy leaders go slow: True character is formed through time, mentorship, and accountability—not through platform or performance.
Deconstruction can lead to rebuilding: When guided by the Spirit, untangling from religious culture can bring us closer to the heart of Jesus.
Recognize toxicity vs. humanity: It’s wise—and sometimes holy—to walk away from spiritually abusive or narcissistic leadership.
Churches need trauma-informed care: Pastors can’t carry every burden; partnering with trained counselors helps the whole Body heal.
Pastors’ kids need freedom and identity: Ministry starts at home; children aren’t sidekicks, they’re uniquely called by God too.
God is patient with our process: Healing from church hurt takes time, and Jesus remains faithful through every season.
Website: natalierunion.com
Instagram: @raisedtostay
Book: Raised to Stay
========================================================
We LOVE that you’ve decided to join us this week for the Living Wholehearted Podcast. We hope you enjoyed the conversation, tips, and resources to help you transform every relationship that matters most to you. If you think this will help someone you know, make sure you send it their way or share on socials. Tag us @living_wholehearted and @terramattson! Don't forget to FOLLOW/SUBSCRIBE so you don't miss an episode and help spread the word by leaving us some stars on a review. Thanks for partnering with us to help more leaders, just like you, who want to live and lead with integrity at home, work and in the community. Go to livingwholehearted.com and sign up to receive our free leadership tips and updates delivered to you in our monthly newsletter. And, if you’re a girl mom, check out mycourageousgirls.com.
Until next time, be the leader you would follow!
Grateful for you,
Jeff & Terra
To connect with Jeff & Terra Mattson and Living Wholehearted, go to:
WEBSITES
RESOURCES
Shrinking the Integrity Gap e-Course
